Romy

00:00:00: Hello, I'm Cormac. You're listening to Clearly Beloved, supported by Amazon Music.

00:00:08: In this series, I invite DJs and musicians, friends and allies from the LGBTQ+ community

00:00:15: to talk about music, queerness and anything else that shapes their unique story. It is

00:00:20: my hope that in sharing our individual experiences, we can learn and grow and focus on our similarities

00:00:27: rather than our differences. You can find all of the music mentioned in today's episode

00:00:33: and each episode at the link in the episode description.

00:00:39: Every once in a while, a band comes along that shakes up the norm and crosses musical

00:00:44: boundaries. The XX are one such band. Their albums are known worldwide and regarded as

00:00:50: timeless pieces of music. Romy Madlycroft is best known as a singer, songwriter and

00:00:57: guitarist for the XX and in solo mode as a DJ and pop star. Her debut album Midair is

00:01:05: the queer love pop album that the world has been waiting for. I'm thrilled to have her

00:01:09: as my very first guest on Clearly Beloved.

00:01:13: Romy, my dear, I'm so grateful that you take time for us to have a chat today.

00:01:21: Thank you for having me. I'm really happy you asked me and I wanted to make the time.

00:01:25: I'm just about to go on tour tomorrow. I'm at home today just packing and being with

00:01:31: my dogs and just trying to get ready for the next stage. But yeah, it's lovely to speak

00:01:36: to you.

00:01:37: Romy, I want to ask you who you are, how you identify and what it is that you do.

00:01:44: Well, my name is Romy and I don't know. That's actually such a straightforward question that

00:01:51: I don't know. Who am I? What do you write when you have to fill out a form that says

00:01:55: like occupation? What do you put?

00:01:59: What do I put? I mean, I usually write, it depends on the day. Yeah, I kind of got used

00:02:05: to writing DJ. But you know, there were some countries that I played in when I first started

00:02:11: where maybe you needed a visa and I didn't necessarily have a visa. So I wouldn't write

00:02:16: DJ. I would write something else. And sometimes when I go to write DJ, I almost pause in

00:02:21: case I'm like, "Shit." And I kind of had to like educate myself that this is actually

00:02:26: my job. So I usually write DJ. Sometimes I write musician.

00:02:31: It's cool. I love the artist of writing DJ. I think that's something that feels very

00:02:35: glamorous to me. I guess I've been typically a write musician. But in the summer when I

00:02:43: was recently just DJ, I traveled somewhere just for one day and was just by myself. And

00:02:50: they were like, "Well, who are you? What do you do? And why are you here for one day?"

00:02:55: And I was like, "I'm a DJ." And then it felt kind of exciting to say that. And then they

00:03:00: were like, "This is crazy that you're here for one." It's post-COVID, I guess, to be

00:03:05: traveling that quickly was unusual. But it was exciting to me to embrace a different

00:03:12: way of performing and traveling. And because typically with a band, you kind of have a

00:03:18: lot of equipment and stuff, and it's less lightweight. But there's something quite exciting

00:03:23: and spontaneous to me of like being able to just go somewhere to DJ and be lightweight

00:03:29: and connect with people and be able to leave. And so that's exciting.

00:03:35: You really don't have to add anything. Some people might have said how they identify in

00:03:42: terms of their sexuality or their identity. I interviewed Peaches last week and she said

00:03:47: she identified as a fruit.

00:03:49: That's wonderful. I think my instinct was like, I mean, I'm a human being. But I think

00:03:56: I would say I identify as a lesbian and as queer and a person who's just out there just

00:04:05: trying my best.

00:04:06: That's more than enough. A big impetus for doing the podcast for me has been because

00:04:11: we have so much focus on our identity at the moment and rightly so, especially for non-heteronormative

00:04:19: people who haven't felt recognized. I think it's very important that identity is recognized.

00:04:26: I agree. I think it's like, you know, when I think about myself as a teenager and like

00:04:31: when you're sort of just looking for role models or you mentioned Peaches. I mean,

00:04:37: Peaches was someone that was hugely inspiring to me. That was my first gig ever. I saw

00:04:41: Peaches play at Brixton Academy. I was just so blown away and Peaches is an incredibly

00:04:48: empowering performer, especially to me, if it's such a shy teenager.

00:04:52: And where did you grow up? Romney?

00:04:55: I grew up in South West London in Wandsworth. So going to Brixton Academy was like a bus

00:05:02: ride away.

00:05:03: Were people in your family like your parents into music?

00:05:07: Yeah, I think you sort of appreciate things about family retrospectively. But I realized

00:05:14: that my parents loved music as like a sort of something that was listened to at dinner

00:05:19: time. It was always the kind of ritual that my dad or mum would put on a record or like

00:05:24: put on some music to sit down to eat. And I think that's something I really love now.

00:05:29: And we would sit and listen. And it would be some conversation, but my mum died when

00:05:35: I was 11. And my dad was quite a shy and quiet person. So then when we would sit just the

00:05:44: two of us together, he maybe wasn't the kind of loudest at the table. So we would just

00:05:48: sit and listen to this music in silence. And that to me feels very like beautiful and sort

00:05:53: of sad and now. But in a lovely way that he would just pick something for us to listen

00:05:58: to that was always very eclectic. And it was very different to, you know, sort of go to

00:06:03: friends houses and there's silence and conversation. And I was thinking what's happening, where's

00:06:08: the music? So I think that that makes me appreciate how much music was a part of their kind of

00:06:15: rituals and that makes me feel kind of happy when I when I think of those memories.

00:06:20: It's beautiful. And there's an intimacy to that as well, like experiencing music, maybe

00:06:26: in the absence of talking. And Prince said that sometimes we're not ready to to express

00:06:35: all of the feelings inside of us. And for that we have songwriting. Yeah, maybe maybe

00:06:41: I'm romanticizing it. But you know, I love that. I think that those experiences maybe

00:06:46: it makes sense to me now why I maybe was quite early on in my life making a lot of mixed

00:06:51: CDs for girls and the things I couldn't say. It was something that I had been experiencing,

00:06:58: I guess, like through him sharing music with me. And I think that that's beautiful. And

00:07:03: I really relate to not being able to say something. So writing it into lyrics has been something

00:07:10: that I've explored a lot in my life.

00:07:13: Well, yeah. And also, like, you know, if your wife's saying, is that how you feel? It's

00:07:17: like that's exactly what you've been doing this past.

00:07:20: Totally. I thought, Oh, God, I've done it again. Yes, I really like you.

00:07:25: It's so amazing. Eleven is so young to lose your mama.

00:07:31: Yeah. Yeah, it was it was like a huge shock and very it was not expected. So I think that

00:07:39: it has taken me a long time. And it's something I'm still processing. But I think that grief

00:07:46: has been a big part of my life. And my dad died when I was 20. So I think, you know, I

00:07:54: think I've experienced a different big sort of quite pivotal moments in my sort of childhood

00:07:59: and then moving into adulthood. And it's made me, yeah, I've learned a sort of the less

00:08:07: life lessons quite young. But I also makes me see life in a in a way that is I am grateful

00:08:15: for, you know, I think I appreciate things in a different way. So I try and see I try

00:08:20: and see the positives. But it is challenging.

00:08:23: Grief is a motherfucker, isn't it? Because it's a yeah, I lost my mom seven years ago

00:08:27: and I lost my dad when I was 18. And I feel also that grief has like been kind of there

00:08:36: from the start in a way, like quite early on and the on picking of that and how it can

00:08:42: seep into perspectives and stuff. It's a it's a long filtration of grief. I mean, I still

00:08:51: I mean, the other day, my father was dead, I think 20 something years. And I mean, I'm

00:08:57: still processing that to some degree. And I have different recollections and like, it's

00:09:02: more peaceful to think of him now than it used to be. And it's a very long journey. It's

00:09:08: almost like, you know, I hear my friends complain about their parents. And I think, well, sort

00:09:14: it out as best you can because when they're gone, they're not actually gone.

00:09:17: Yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah. It's been interesting in my life and in music, like trying to figure

00:09:24: out like talking about how I feel, you know, like, I've always been quite a person that

00:09:29: says, I'm fine, I'm fine, you know, don't worry about me and sort of wearing that as

00:09:32: like a badge of honor. But at the same time, sort of realizing actually, sometimes I'm

00:09:37: not okay. And I'm things just kind of whether you can push things down, but they do come

00:09:41: up sometimes when you least expect it. And I've tried to express that more in songwriting

00:09:47: in this album.

00:09:48: Your dad, was he cool with the gay stuff?

00:09:51: He was actually, and I'm very grateful for that, you know, to have felt that from him.

00:09:57: In a way, we were more, our relationship was more like friends. You know, he was quite,

00:10:01: he wasn't a super authoritative figure. He kind of gave me a lot of independence and

00:10:08: trust at a young age, which is why one of the reasons maybe why I was going out in Soho

00:10:13: at 16 and 17. I'm grateful for that trust because I had, you know, experiences that

00:10:19: changed my life. But he never made me feel that it wasn't okay. He just sort of very

00:10:24: subtly acknowledged it. He used to work in the local library and he one day brought me

00:10:29: back a flyer from the sort of, I can't remember what it was called in those days, but it was

00:10:34: basically like a queer book fair. And he'd like left it next to my computer. And I sort

00:10:40: of looked at him and he looked at me and it was an exchange, silent acknowledgement.

00:10:44: So I'm very grateful for that sort of generosity of him, just sort of letting me know he acknowledged

00:10:53: it and it was okay.

00:10:56: That's very cool as well because, you know, no teenager kind of wants their dad to sit

00:11:01: and talk about their sex life or their love life anyway. So that's a very cool move on

00:11:06: your dad's part.

00:11:07: Yeah, no, I'm grateful for that. I mean, I was definitely giving him, when he started

00:11:12: to date again, you know, I was trying to give him advice as well. So we would, it was more

00:11:17: like a friendship, which I, which I love in retrospect. I love thinking about now.

00:11:23: Can you choose for me a track, Romy, when you speak about those times sitting at the

00:11:30: dinner table and listening to music, is there one particular record or track that you could

00:11:35: mention that brings you back to that time?

00:11:39: There's so many, I think it was hard to choose, but I think I picked Dion Warwick Walk On

00:11:44: By because I realized sort of in my adult life, I suddenly knew all the words to all

00:11:51: of this Dion Warwick, but backtrack music. And I was just sort of singing it. And I was

00:11:56: like, why do I know this music? Like, well, this music is like in my subconscious. And

00:12:02: it's quite lyrically intricate. And I, I realized that I had a memory of sitting with both my

00:12:07: parents, which I don't have a huge amount of memories of both of them together. Because

00:12:11: I was, you know, young when my mum passed away. But yeah, this, this song, I just have

00:12:16: a memory of listening to it together at the dinner table. And I think, you know, it's

00:12:22: still a song I love today and the amount of emotion in it. And it's just a brilliant

00:12:26: song. And I felt like a nice one to share.

00:12:29: And we mentioned Peaches as a first introduction to queer music, let's say. Is there a Peaches

00:12:37: track you could choose?

00:12:38: Yeah, I think there's so many that is, you know, I think Fatherfucker as an album, like

00:12:44: it was something that I just, I remember I bought that for Jamie from the XX for his

00:12:50: birthday, which we laugh about now. But you know, this time he was like really, he was

00:12:57: really into electronic music. And I just thought that he'd really like the production. And

00:13:01: like, and he does, he does. And we, we, we listened to it on vinyl together back then.

00:13:08: And a song that now when I listen back to that album, I still really love is Tombstone

00:13:12: Baby. I think it's such a cool, amazingly produced track. A song I definitely, I'd

00:13:18: like to play that out in a club. I've never done that. It's kind of, it's pretty crazy

00:13:21: BPM that I'd love to, I'd love to pick.

00:13:24: It's a great choice. And the video also is great.

00:13:28: Yeah. No, I love that.

00:13:30: So great. Actually, when I spoke with Peaches last week, you know, quite funnily, she told

00:13:35: me like, she got signed to Sony and they were very excited. But then she made a video where

00:13:40: her pubic hair was growing and growing and growing. And then they weren't so excited.

00:13:48: When you make music, Romie, do you often start with lyrics or do you start with the musical

00:13:54: idea or how was your beginning process?

00:13:58: It's changed. When I first started some writing, I used to just write poems. I was, you know,

00:14:04: it wasn't until I was like, super happy with all of the words on the page that I had the

00:14:10: confidence to sing it. So I used to just like really obsess over the words and then be very

00:14:14: shy about seeing it.

00:14:15: Oh, God.

00:14:16: But if I was proud of the words, then I'd be a bit more comfortable singing it. And so

00:14:20: it was like that for a long time. Then I got into writing with other people, sort of pop

00:14:25: songwriting. And the whole idea of that is you're sat with a stranger and somebody just

00:14:30: plays a chord on the piano and is, you're there as the singer or the top line writer.

00:14:35: So they're like seeing something. And I was like, I froze because I sort of thought, well,

00:14:41: I don't have my words that I've perfected. I just, you know, and then that's where the

00:14:46: whole kind of a new method of working came for me, which is just melody writing. And

00:14:52: that's how a lot of, I guess, is more typically a style of songwriting that the melody leads

00:14:58: and then you fit lyrics to a melody. And so then a lot of my new music has been melody

00:15:04: first, lyric second. And that was really fun and different to just explore.

00:15:11: Yeah. And kind of, you know, get the hook of the track nailed first in a way, maybe,

00:15:18: or get the, yeah, and then fit things in a rounder. In a way, I would imagine that's

00:15:24: quite freeing because I haven't written songs, certainly not to the extent that you have,

00:15:31: but I also write poetry and I've tried to fit that into tracks, et cetera. And sometimes

00:15:37: that's so, so bearing that it's like gut wrenching to sing in front of someone or to expose what

00:15:48: it is you've been feeling. Whereas, you know, how you describe it, if you're kind of focusing

00:15:54: on, let's get the vibe of this thing going first, I think that kind of frees it up or

00:15:58: something that makes it, maybe it makes it less personal. I don't know. I've had the

00:16:03: experience sometimes that things can be so personal that it's painful.

00:16:07: Yeah. So definitely, I know that feeling very well. It's the sort of a balance of really

00:16:14: wanting to try and get an emotion out and like process it. And that for me, songwriting

00:16:20: has been amazing for that. But then in terms of collaborating, especially with someone

00:16:25: you maybe don't know so well, the idea of then processing or expressing those feelings

00:16:30: in front of them is challenging. I think that's why, you know, I've only really had

00:16:37: only previously made music with Oliver and Jamie from the XX and two of my oldest friends.

00:16:43: So when I was kind of going into making new music, I think I wasn't thinking I was making

00:16:49: songs for me. When I was doing these songwriting sessions, which I was really curious to write

00:16:55: songs for other people as a way to not have to feel that excruciating feeling that I'm

00:17:01: writing this honest song, I could just, you know, I'm writing for someone else. But in

00:17:07: doing that, you're not often in the room with the person that's going to sing the song.

00:17:12: Sometimes you are and I love that because I can just talk to them and say, how are you

00:17:16: feeling? What do you what are you trying to express? And I love that. But in terms of

00:17:22: a big sort of pop star, a lot of the time, they just want song sent in. So you're just

00:17:28: you're just given a brief and to write a song about anything for someone you've never met

00:17:34: for me ended up meaning that I wrote very personal songs because I thought I can just

00:17:40: draw on my own experience and no one's going to know it's about me. And turned out that

00:17:44: I really enjoyed that. And people were like, why are you giving this song away? It's clearly

00:17:48: about you. So it just took me some time to be like, actually, okay, maybe I'll keep it.

00:17:53: But it took me a bit of time to get there.

00:17:56: It's so fascinating. It's kind of a dream of mine to sit in a like pop song writing brainstorm,

00:18:03: you know, because sometimes I feel like I've got the guts of a track, but not quite the

00:18:07: other bits and that collaborative thing can be really, really fun. I think I think for

00:18:12: me sometimes the personal thing was painful because there was a long period of time where

00:18:17: I would write from quite a depressed place. I have depression and I managed that in various

00:18:25: ways. But certainly I managed it through songwriting sometimes. And then there's a lot of depression

00:18:32: where you're kind of just getting on with the day and getting your strength up and presenting

00:18:39: as if you're well. And then, you know, your songwriting is like, hey, busted.

00:18:47: Like this is very clearly you're clearly not feeling very well. And I find that quite intense.

00:18:54: But you know, I told you before I've been listening to your album a lot. I really genuinely

00:18:59: love it.

00:19:00: Thank you so much.

00:19:02: You're so welcome. Honestly, it's such an uplifting, heart-giddying, reassuring, beautiful piece

00:19:11: of music.

00:19:12: Well, thank you. That's very beautifully said.

00:19:15: Well, you know, because I really believe it and I really feel that from it. And I can

00:19:21: imagine that writing from that place, because it's such a beautiful love album, that that's

00:19:28: also comes with a lot of vulnerability.

00:19:30: Yeah, definitely. I think that, yeah, there had to be a moment in time where I just went,

00:19:40: I'm going to not think about who's going to hear this apart from the person I'm writing

00:19:44: it about and try to be as honest and as open as I could and not worry too much about, you

00:19:52: know, whoever's going to hear it.

00:19:54: It was funny because I wrote quite a lot of the songs in lockdown. And, you know, it

00:20:00: was just me and Vic, who's now my wife, who a lot of the songs are about at home together

00:20:06: and there's no collaboration really in that sense, in terms of like, I'm just sat there

00:20:10: writing a song and then she'd come into the room and I'd say, oh, can I play what I'm

00:20:14: working on? And then obviously, it's about her. So then she's like, she was like, wow,

00:20:20: is that really how you feel? And I was like, oh, yeah, have I not, have I not, I'm sorry

00:20:29: if I haven't said that to you in words. This is, but what is it, is it a good song? Should

00:20:34: I carry on? You know, is this kind of mixed expectation or sort of responsibility I put

00:20:40: on her to be like an A&R and a recipient of a love song? But she was, she was brilliant

00:20:47: at that.

00:20:48: There's that thing about, you know, when you make music, you really, or when you make anything,

00:20:54: I guess, is to enjoy the process and forget the outcome. And I guess part of writing songs

00:21:00: is to maybe at least write in very personal things as you describe as to forget maybe

00:21:06: that they will be listened to here or like, or not put yourself in that situation of how

00:21:11: is this received? Because we never really know how it's received. We're only really

00:21:16: in charge of what we put into it, aren't we?

00:21:19: Yeah, definitely. I think, you know, for just taking on some experience I've had from music,

00:21:25: releasing music with the XX is that with our first album, I really didn't expect there

00:21:30: are many people to hear it apart from a very small group. And I had to go through the process

00:21:36: of realizing more people were hearing this music than I ever imagined. And it was very

00:21:41: personal. And I, in the end, loved how personal it was. And then it reached more people. But

00:21:47: it was out of my hands. You know, that was just like a shyness. Then from then making

00:21:52: making music since then you're sort of more aware of someone's going to hear this song.

00:21:57: And so on this project, I just tried to kind of reconnect with that energy of when we made

00:22:02: the first album and I didn't know who was going to hear it. I just was trying to express

00:22:05: an emotion. And it was good to reconnect with that and try and be a bit naive with it again.

00:22:12: It's kind of insane, like how massive that album, that first album was, it kind of, it

00:22:19: changed things a bit. It's kind of, it's funny to hear you say, oh, like, I didn't really

00:22:23: expect so many people to hear it. Because it just kind of crossed so many different avenues

00:22:31: of music. And it touched a lot of people. And there's a few tracks on that album, I

00:22:35: think, that probably belong to the people now. It's kind of bizarre. It's like, you

00:22:39: know, they've become so ingrained in a certain generation's ear.

00:22:44: It is crazy. I think, you know, song like Intro, which is the first track on the album,

00:22:49: which Oliver and I joke about is the one song that doesn't actually have us singing

00:22:53: on. You know, I've seen that song emerge in situations that I could never imagine. You

00:22:58: know, it was, I think somebody, it was on the World Cup final penalties. They were playing

00:23:05: that. And I was like, what? What? You just sort of think this song is, it's something

00:23:12: that we made when we were like 19, that is now sort of out there in the world in these

00:23:17: different experiences of kind of high intensity sport moment, which I love is not what we were

00:23:23: ever imagining. But I love that that's where it's ended up. And that's what's beautiful.

00:23:28: Beautiful about music. You know, once it's out in the world, it's either on the BBC,

00:23:34: on Britain's Worst Eaters, or it's, you know, in someone's home. I get texts from people

00:23:41: being like, did you know your song was on that? And they're like, oh my God. Okay.

00:23:44: Yeah, I think sometimes some albums and some music, there's a zeitgeist to it, the same

00:23:50: with clubs, actually. You know, like we, when we first met, we were talking about a club

00:23:55: that we both went to the ghetto. And, you know, having been around the world a bit,

00:24:00: and investigated various scenes in different countries and different times, there was a real

00:24:07: zeitgeist to that time in that club in London. There was something special going on that was,

00:24:15: you can't create that by design. It's a culmination of the people, the time, the place,

00:24:23: what's just come before, what's about to come after. There's just, there's so many elements

00:24:29: to it where it's an intangible thing to create somehow. Yeah, I think that I'm so grateful

00:24:37: for that time and that club and that, you know, I think that it's nice to, when we spoke, when we

00:24:42: first spoke, that, you know, that you, that you know it and that you've experienced it too, because

00:24:46: I think for me, only now, like looking back and like sort of reflecting a bit on like,

00:24:51: you know, my love of DJing and the importance of like queer clubbing and like the community and

00:24:56: friendships and all of those experiences I had when I first went out in London and how important

00:25:03: and influential that was for me, like, and I think just wanting to celebrate that with this

00:25:07: album I've done, but realizing that I missed that and where is that now and like, where do I find

00:25:13: that now? And like, it makes you kind of appreciate things, I guess, in the past. But for me, that

00:25:19: was all I knew because that was the first, that was my first kind of queer club experience and

00:25:23: growing up in London and that being like a place I got into underage for me was life changing.

00:25:30: So I feel grateful that you're saying, you know, it was a moment in time, I'm happy that I happened

00:25:35: to just stumble into that as my, my sort of local queer bar experience. That really was, you know,

00:25:41: having been in London for some years before that, that was quite a start. If that was your first

00:25:49: gay club or, you know, trash palace and stuff like those, there was such a

00:25:52: sense of excitement and possibility. When you say trash palace, I was like remembering,

00:25:58: I did flyering for trash, trash palace and get a, I was probably not a very good person to like

00:26:06: sell the club. I looked very shy and miserable, but I had the flyers and I was standing on

00:26:10: old Constancy. Oh my God. But yeah. Was there a track from those times that reminds you of when

00:26:17: you first started going out? I think that when I think about just being like in like a queer space,

00:26:24: I think that kind of celebration and enjoyment of pop music without irony and like that just like

00:26:29: appreciation. That's not, not with this, you know, it doesn't come from that same energy as like a

00:26:35: wedding set. It comes, you know, like where people are like, oh, this is, oh, we're listening to this.

00:26:41: Yeah. It's like, I love this song and here we are, we're listening to this song and then it's

00:26:44: with loving it. And I really resonated with that. And that's something that has stayed with me so

00:26:49: much. And, you know, just that appreciation and enjoyment of pop in its all its glory. I was

00:26:55: thinking about to when the, you know, what the, the sort of area was, it would have been like for

00:27:00: like current pop at the time I was going out. And I think that this Madonna album Confessions on a

00:27:05: dance floor would have been out at around that time. And I guess there's the big songs like

00:27:10: hung up and sorry from that album. And I really love that album. But this song gets together.

00:27:16: It really, it makes me think about, I remember hearing this and just like, there's a, there's a

00:27:23: feeling of like a hazy, clubby, poppy, like kind of combination that makes me think of kind of

00:27:31: going out at that time. And it's one of the ones that I always kind of wanted to hear in a club.

00:27:37: And I feel like maybe I heard it once or twice, but in reaction to that, I would now play it when

00:27:42: I DJ as a sort of wanting to, you know, just to hear it loud and that takes me back to that time.

00:27:49: Do you know what? It's so funny you mentioned that track because that album is just great. And

00:27:56: like, I think there are so many different Madonna's through time. But Madonna, when she's like a call

00:28:02: to action, like get up and dance, she does it so well. And that track, when I heard that album

00:28:09: hung up, yeah, I was the single and I think jump was the single and something else. But

00:28:15: get together was the really stand out one for me because it felt really like dubby French house.

00:28:21: And I learned recently, I don't know if it's correct that it was based on the idea of it was

00:28:27: based on Stardust, the music sounds better with you. Oh, yeah. It was kind of based on the

00:28:34: structure of that. But I must ask you because you've been working with Stuart Price, what's that

00:28:39: like? Yeah, I mean, I am a huge fan of Stuart and of his production and all of the different

00:28:49: projects he's done and the confessions on Dance Floor was just on my reference playlists.

00:28:55: When I was making this album, and I, my manager said to me, would you, why don't you have a

00:29:00: conversation with Stuart? And I, that's not something that you just can happen all the time.

00:29:05: So I wasn't expecting it to happen, you know, but he was lovely. And we had a,

00:29:10: we just became friends very naturally and spoke loads about pop music and dance music and the

00:29:16: way they intersect. And he's very generous with me asking that sound on this on get together,

00:29:23: you know, like me like geeking out about the production details and, you know, and he's like,

00:29:27: oh, that's a reversed sound. And this is this. And so for me, I was very excited to work with him.

00:29:35: And to, it's really cool and unique to be like, oh, this is my reference song. But oh, you made

00:29:41: this song. Oh, wow. Okay. It's crazy. So, but he was lovely at embracing that not, you know,

00:29:49: it's not that I wanted to make something to drag him back into his past work. It didn't,

00:29:53: it didn't feel energetically like that. He felt excited to like, explore some of those sounds and

00:30:00: those references again, which I, which I was grateful for. And it was fun to kind of get some

00:30:05: of the behind the scenes fun facts. Something with your album, when I listened to it,

00:30:14: I didn't immediately know that Stuart was involved in it. Not until I read the credits,

00:30:20: because I'm a credit geek. And I think that's a good thing because it's a credit to him,

00:30:26: because he doesn't do the same thing each time. And I really feel like there's a

00:30:31: delicacy to your album that was also present in the XX, but it's very different. And it seems

00:30:39: like a bit of a theme for you. And I think it sounds like you. Oh, thank you. It took me quite a

00:30:45: long time to figure out, okay, if I am going to make music outside of the XX, what does it sound

00:30:49: like? And I'm really drawn to these kind of dance sounds, but like pop dance and like things that

00:30:57: feel not alienating sounds, I want to feel people to feel drawn in warm and like accessible. I worked

00:31:04: with quite a lot of different producers. And I was drawn towards people who make kind of dance

00:31:09: music and realizing that finding the kind of right collaborator to make songs that you can

00:31:15: dance to, but also singing along to and like finding that balance between pop and dance

00:31:20: took me longer than expected and was a big learning experience. But I had a kind of a clear vision

00:31:27: in my head, I think, and I was very obsessed with trying to find that balance. And between

00:31:33: working with Fred again, and like us just really bonding over a love again of pop and

00:31:39: and the song as well as as the dance music production side and really connecting with him

00:31:46: on that. And then sort of figuring out, wow, okay, how do I make it sound like me though,

00:31:53: like not not like Fred, not like Jamie who worked on some songs. But and I think Stuart really helped

00:31:59: me find take those elements and find my own balance with it and help me feel empowered to

00:32:07: have my ideas. And I mean, so did Fred as well, it was nice to find those friendships where they

00:32:12: were like encouraging me to like what's your what's in your head, you know, and I think I've

00:32:19: gotten more like, I mean, I'm really obsessed with production details and structure and the flow

00:32:26: of a song. And so that's very much my involvement in the production. It's like very I'm obsessed with

00:32:31: all the elements, you know, and and finding that balance, especially on a song that enjoy your life

00:32:37: where there's a song, there's all these samples, there's a song in there, there's these different

00:32:42: rhythms, it's you I want people to be dancing and feeling the emotion. I spent a long time with

00:32:48: all the different stems just trying to find that balance. I was trying to find what was in my head,

00:32:53: I guess, you did a very good job, I must say.

00:32:55: Because there's a euphoria there that I would associate more with the good side of, everyone's

00:33:03: talking about the 90s, they never stopped talking about the 90s, but the good side of

00:33:07: like, you know, elements of trance.

00:33:10: But part of trance, for example, was a very long extension of things in a bill, but there's

00:33:15: a euphoria that hits in your album that is reminiscent of that, but done in a very pop

00:33:23: structure way.

00:33:24: And it's very clever.

00:33:25: The other thing I love about your album is that it's like, what, 36 minutes long or something?

00:33:30: And I have this theory, I don't know if it's true, but I feel like all the really great

00:33:36: classic pop albums are less than 45 minutes.

00:33:39: Okay, that's interesting.

00:33:41: You know, punk, for example, one of the great things about punk music was that every track

00:33:46: was like three minutes.

00:33:48: It was like, you get up, you do it.

00:33:50: And the message is there.

00:33:53: And I think when the message is there and the elements are right, it's like a smack

00:33:58: in the face.

00:33:59: It's not, that's maybe not a good analogy.

00:34:02: I grew up in Northern Ireland.

00:34:04: Sorry.

00:34:05: No, I...

00:34:06: It doesn't have to be drawn out.

00:34:07: It's like, boom, that's it.

00:34:08: We hit it.

00:34:09: And your album has that.

00:34:11: There's a punk sensibility to it in that regard of just being very potent.

00:34:16: Yeah, I'm obsessed with that as well.

00:34:18: I think that I love this concept that the perfect pop song is three minutes, 30, like

00:34:24: whenever I sort of work on something structurally and it fits in less time than that, I'm very

00:34:29: satisfied.

00:34:30: I'm really conscious that I wanted the song, the moment you press play, there to be a sound

00:34:36: that catches your ear.

00:34:38: So you know what the song is, even if it's subconscious.

00:34:41: I put your album on most mornings.

00:34:43: I find it really uplifting.

00:34:45: I don't always wake up in the best headspace.

00:34:47: My headspace is like something I have to work on.

00:34:50: It's a practice of different things to try and get me in the right headspace and music

00:34:56: is one of them.

00:34:57: And I find your album very uplifting and positive and hopeful.

00:35:02: And one of my friends said to me, it's really lovely to hear a same-sex love album that's

00:35:09: so positive.

00:35:11: A lot of our music throughout time, like if you think of like "Small Town Boy" or even

00:35:17: "Culture Club" and stuff, all of that was kind of about unrequited love.

00:35:21: That was like a broken heart of like a gay guy falling in love with a straight guy and

00:35:26: just never going to work.

00:35:28: Your album is so positive.

00:35:30: If I was a kid listening to that now, that's so encouraging.

00:35:35: Well, that means a lot that he say that.

00:35:39: That's all I'd ever hoped for.

00:35:41: In the past, I have written a lot of not so explicitly queer love songs about heartache.

00:35:47: And I was just excited to have the opportunity.

00:35:49: It sort of gave me motivation and like the kind of allowed me to give myself the permission

00:35:55: to make a solo project, with the intention to try and make something that was positive

00:36:00: and a celebration of queer love and to kind of hopefully be a step to normalising that

00:36:07: within the frame of like a pop song.

00:36:11: You know, I didn't think that if these songs make it onto like a mainstream radio station

00:36:17: and then somebody clocks, "Oh, is she singing?

00:36:20: Is she to say I love her?"

00:36:23: You know, and then that'd be normal.

00:36:25: "Oh, that's fine.

00:36:26: That's okay."

00:36:27: And then a little step towards normalising it, I would be so happy.

00:36:31: It was really interesting to hear that like she's on my mind, a song from the album is

00:36:36: like doing really well at the radio in Turkey.

00:36:39: And I was like, "That's amazing."

00:36:40: You know, like great, but it's just fascinating how once you make, you have that intention

00:36:45: and you make the song and you put it out into the world and you don't know what's going

00:36:48: to happen.

00:36:49: But I love the idea that people are listening to it.

00:36:51: You're like a stealth queer revolutionary sneaking same songs into Turkey.

00:36:58: I love it.

00:36:59: It's like, do you know like Freddie Mercury like had a rock and roll band, looked like

00:37:02: a complete clone called a queen.

00:37:05: And the majority of people who loved it were straight and a lot of people did not get that

00:37:10: he was a big queen.

00:37:12: And I mean, it's so stealth to do that.

00:37:15: I mean, jokes aside, you should be really proud of that because I think we don't have

00:37:19: enough of that in our ears and in our world for generations.

00:37:25: You know, the queer people in our media, we've had our depth taken out of us somehow.

00:37:32: Like we're either the comic effect or like there's usually some male perspective involved

00:37:39: when it's two women together.

00:37:43: There's always this kind of devaluing or diffusing of our identity.

00:37:49: And I think you should be really proud to put that out as your first album because you

00:37:53: know the effect that music can have on us and music can change kids lives.

00:37:59: And you know, we've had our, you had peaches, someone now has you, you know, that's really,

00:38:04: really amazing Romy.

00:38:06: Thank you.

00:38:07: Thanks for saying that.

00:38:08: But that's, that's, that's all I could ever really hope for from doing that.

00:38:13: When did you make the click to think I could make music or I could perform or I could DJ

00:38:19: or when did that happen?

00:38:21: I think I started writing songs as a way to express how I was feeling in my head, but

00:38:26: it was very private and very, I was very shy about sharing that with anyone.

00:38:31: I used to whisper it late at night when I was singing to myself so that my dad didn't

00:38:36: hear.

00:38:37: I was not the kid at school that wanted to be on the stage or, you know, look at me

00:38:42: or it was kind of quite counter.

00:38:45: It didn't quite match up, I think to my extended family when I said, oh, I'm, I make music.

00:38:51: And then the next day we're quite shocked and I, at that time, Oliver from the XX and

00:38:57: I would been best friends since we were three.

00:38:59: So we've grown up together and I would say, I said to him, by the way, I think I like

00:39:04: singing.

00:39:05: And then he was like, what?

00:39:07: And then I was like, what would you, why?

00:39:09: Well, he's like, wait, so do I.

00:39:11: And it was this kind of quite unexpected, a secret side of both of us that we then shared

00:39:18: with each other.

00:39:19: So it was like, no, I don't want to sing.

00:39:20: I don't want to sing.

00:39:21: And then we sang together.

00:39:23: And that's kind of how the band started is we sang together and our voices kind of fit,

00:39:29: which my love and we didn't really try to do.

00:39:32: Had you both come out to each other at that point?

00:39:34: Let me think.

00:39:35: I think, yes, I think that was quite early on in us coming out to each other.

00:39:39: But yeah, I think by then we would have done.

00:39:42: Yeah, just felt like another extension of our friendship.

00:39:45: And we both were obsessed with music, going to gigs.

00:39:48: And it felt fun to just try it ourselves.

00:39:52: And I think through my space, that was a big vehicle to share music at the time.

00:39:58: We just made some music and put it on my space.

00:40:01: And it was very, I'm grateful for that as a way to just create something and share it

00:40:06: with the world.

00:40:07: In doing that, we ended up starting to play some gigs.

00:40:11: And I don't think we looked like we wanted to be on the stage, probably for about two,

00:40:16: three years of doing it.

00:40:17: Just for some reason, we just kept doing it.

00:40:23: And I think that I'm grateful we did.

00:40:26: And it felt like at that time, playing live was very much part of the people we admired

00:40:33: or the scene that we were drawn towards of like sort of more indie music at that time.

00:40:39: People played live.

00:40:40: So there we were sort of standing there, feeling very self-conscious.

00:40:45: But over time, I think we really loved it and grew into it.

00:40:49: I think we love the songwriting and the creation side.

00:40:53: But I think the performance element has been something we've grown into, both of us.

00:40:59: And yeah, that's, I guess, a slightly high-speed version of events.

00:41:05: And the DJing came after then as the DJing more recent?

00:41:08: I started DJing around the same time as we started playing live.

00:41:13: So I got given the opportunity to DJ at Ghetto.

00:41:17: So that was my introduction to DJing.

00:41:19: I used to go there all the time.

00:41:20: And then it was sort of said, well, would you like to DJ?

00:41:23: And I said, like, I don't know how.

00:41:25: And he said, well, just burn some CDs and come back next week.

00:41:28: He fade it in and out.

00:41:29: I was like, okay.

00:41:32: And I was empowering just to think I'm just going to give this a go.

00:41:35: And what I loved is that it helped me as a shy person connect with a room for a lot of

00:41:41: people in a way that I couldn't through talking, but through playing a song and feeling the

00:41:46: energy and the reaction of people grateful to hear it or excited about what was coming

00:41:51: out of the speakers.

00:41:52: That made me feel so excited and alive and like connected to them.

00:41:58: And like something of feeling that I still love now.

00:42:01: But I stopped DJing when the XX were touring.

00:42:05: I think I had an experience where I would have the opportunity to DJ after XX gig.

00:42:11: And I played a lot of the music that I've been playing at ghetto.

00:42:15: And people said to me, are you taking the piss?

00:42:19: And I was like, what do you mean?

00:42:22: I was just playing joyful pop dance music that I loved.

00:42:25: And it was just very different, I think, to the music that we were making with the XX.

00:42:31: And so interesting.

00:42:33: It's different to the perception that maybe someone that's coming to see our band would

00:42:36: have thought that I was into.

00:42:39: And it honestly made me freeze.

00:42:40: Did that put you off DJing for a bit?

00:42:43: It did.

00:42:44: I think at that age, like I think I was probably 20.

00:42:47: And I think at that point, I was just so grateful that people were interested in our band.

00:42:53: I didn't want to do anything to disrupt it.

00:42:57: I just was so protective of this kind of new thing that was growing that I found that experience

00:43:04: quite confronting.

00:43:05: And I don't know if it made me feel a little bit confused.

00:43:09: And I think I definitely hid.

00:43:12: And like just took a step back from being as visible about my sexuality, about my love

00:43:17: of pop music.

00:43:18: I just kind of retreated a bit.

00:43:21: And I think that's naturally maybe just having a sort of spotlight shown on me at that age.

00:43:27: I kind of was just more private.

00:43:30: And I understand why, but I also think I got to the point where I was like, I really miss

00:43:35: this and I really want to celebrate my love of everything that I've kind of been more

00:43:40: guarded about.

00:43:41: And I think this whole project has been me sort of realizing that I've gone back to that

00:43:45: moment where someone kind of confronted me and questioned it.

00:43:48: And now I'm going, yes, I love this and I don't care.

00:43:51: I'm going to continue it.

00:43:52: But it sort of stopped me in my tracks for a bit.

00:43:56: It's almost like a second coming out.

00:43:57: Yeah, I think so.

00:43:59: Yeah.

00:44:00: I sometimes wonder as queer people do we naturally closet some things, you know, because if

00:44:05: you grow up in a, everyone's experience is different.

00:44:08: But if you grow up where in a culture where there's not so many positive references, you

00:44:13: do learn, I'll speak for myself, kind of learn to edit parts of myself or hold parts of ourselves

00:44:21: back.

00:44:22: I think probably all people do that to some degree, but maybe as queer people we have

00:44:26: less positive reference points and we get very good at that.

00:44:30: I mean, I was in the closet with my sexuality.

00:44:33: I was in the closet with my drug addiction.

00:44:36: I was in the closet with my depression.

00:44:38: I've been in so many closets.

00:44:39: I mean, I could have a clothes collection.

00:44:42: It's insane.

00:44:43: Yeah.

00:44:44: And then going back and finding those things and there might be more joy to be found in

00:44:50: confirming and affirming your love of pop music, maybe more than saying, I'm a drug addict,

00:44:56: but there is value in both of those things because they're step forwards.

00:45:00: You know, they're like, this is how it is.

00:45:02: I have to absolutely.

00:45:03: And it's a releasing of a needing to like have that masking and like that veiling of

00:45:07: these things that are real.

00:45:09: And whether it is a love of pop music or, you know, an addiction, I think it's good to

00:45:14: like, let, let it go and like be able to be honest.

00:45:17: Yes.

00:45:18: There are so many different things.

00:45:19: But yeah, how did you feel being more open about things?

00:45:24: Well, I was in the closet to myself about my addiction.

00:45:27: I didn't realize I had a problem with drugs and alcohol.

00:45:31: I did have a slight indication when I moved from Ireland to England and it was quite messy

00:45:38: and I thought, oh, people don't get as drunk and as wasted here.

00:45:42: But I just thought, oh, I'm Irish.

00:45:44: Right.

00:45:45: And it's kind of, it just kind of, it kept going and I, and really, you know, it certainly

00:45:51: wasn't perhaps as messy as some people and it was messier than other people's.

00:45:57: But really for me, the, the problem was the inside chaos.

00:46:03: You know, I was trying to self-medicate with substances.

00:46:07: I had quite bad depression and I was using substances to try and medicate that.

00:46:13: And then of course in the end, you know, that got quite messy and then it also stopped working.

00:46:20: So I was kind of pushed into a situation to confront that.

00:46:25: And although I had a lot of madness, I somehow also had some common sense and I was able to

00:46:31: say, okay, like I'm spinning my wheels here and I never, I can't imagine that my journey

00:46:40: into my mental health is going to be much fun, but it's never going to get better until

00:46:44: I stop throwing hand grenades into the equation on weekends.

00:46:51: So I kind of went and got a lot of help and I started to go to 12 step groups and I got

00:46:58: a therapist and I still lean heavily on those.

00:47:03: You know, I'd been partying like since I was 14 really, like ingesting something to change

00:47:08: the way I feel.

00:47:09: So I was 14 and stopping that, like learning how to live life without something to change

00:47:17: how I feel.

00:47:18: It was like learning a new language.

00:47:20: It was like waking up.

00:47:21: Like I had to get help.

00:47:22: It was just stopping that and knowing how to do it would be saying like, okay, you know,

00:47:27: I'm going to wake up tomorrow and I'm going to be fluent and finish.

00:47:30: I was obviously going to have to invest time and effort into learning how to do that because

00:47:39: I didn't know how to.

00:47:41: So I mean, in terms of the closet question, I talk about it here with you and I talk about

00:47:45: it sometimes with people.

00:47:48: I don't run about with it on a t-shirt, but only because I felt like when I was getting

00:47:53: wasted and when I was very messy and a liability to my friends, I feel like it took up a lot

00:47:59: of space and I don't then want my sobriety to take up a lot of space, you know, kind

00:48:05: of want to be open about it in that I'm not ashamed of it.

00:48:11: I don't regret anything.

00:48:12: And also, you know, addiction is no stranger to us as queer people.

00:48:17: We're three times more likely to deal with addiction, three times more likely to deal

00:48:23: with mental health issues.

00:48:24: And I think, you know, I don't have all the answers, but talking about it surely must

00:48:30: help other people, you know, like we need to talk about it.

00:48:34: Definitely.

00:48:35: I think that I think although I respect and I understand what you're saying about being

00:48:40: in the place where you think that you don't want to take up space by talking about the

00:48:44: sobriety or sobriety, I also think that hearing you talk about it and the way that you acknowledge

00:48:49: that you wanted to make some changes and you figured out ways to help yourself is very

00:48:55: inspiring and beautiful to hear that.

00:48:57: That's very kind of you to say.

00:48:59: Thank you.

00:49:00: It's also maybe not the conversations that we're so used to having in club spaces.

00:49:04: Yeah.

00:49:05: Because it's like very often we're at our best or in some elevated form, but a lot of

00:49:11: people suffer during the week.

00:49:13: A lot of people don't.

00:49:14: A lot of people are having great times and more power to them.

00:49:17: You know, if the only thing that a bit of excess costs you is money, then go for it.

00:49:23: You know, but for me, it was costing me more.

00:49:26: It was kind of costing me my peace of mind and my health and my friendships.

00:49:30: And I just got really tired of wrestling with it and it was easier.

00:49:36: Ultimately, it didn't seem at the time, but ultimately it was easier for me just to put

00:49:41: those things down and accept that in this lifetime for whatever reason, wrestling with

00:49:46: those things is a bit, it's too much of a gamble for me.

00:49:50: Well, I think it's amazing that you've done that.

00:49:52: And I think that's, it's not easy.

00:49:54: I know and like a lot of friends that I've observed and admired and sort of witnessed

00:50:02: wrestling with addiction and not being ready to acknowledge it.

00:50:06: So the fact that you acknowledged it and are working through it, I think is very powerful.

00:50:11: Thank you.

00:50:12: It took some time.

00:50:13: I tried to change everything except that.

00:50:16: I tried to change everything except putting down drugs and alcohol, but it was just like

00:50:22: rearranging furniture on the Titanic.

00:50:24: It wasn't working out.

00:50:32: You know, I wanted to tell you, Romy, we both had our first DJ gig at the ghetto.

00:50:36: Oh, wow.

00:50:37: That's amazing.

00:50:38: Isn't that insane?

00:50:39: That's so cool.

00:50:40: Wow.

00:50:41: That's so special.

00:50:42: Yes.

00:50:43: Yeah.

00:50:44: What were you playing back then?

00:50:45: I was playing.

00:50:47: I was buying vinyl for quite a while and I remember I was playing a lot of electroclash

00:50:54: stuff.

00:50:55: I would have played litigra, for example.

00:50:58: I would have played also Tiga and I would have played, what else?

00:51:04: I was playing a lot of pop music.

00:51:06: I mean, I really love a lot of like 12 inch dance mixes, Shep Pedibone, things like that.

00:51:14: So my goal with DJing was to kind of find this space between the place where dance music

00:51:22: brought me, but pop music also brought me there.

00:51:24: I think really what you could say is like somehow merged the euphoria that I felt with

00:51:31: dance music and somehow occasionally bring in the message of what I was getting through

00:51:37: pop music somehow.

00:51:38: So, but it took me a while maybe to get good at that in the way I wanted to.

00:51:44: So I was probably playing quite a mix match of different vinyls at the time and mixing

00:51:51: it very badly.

00:51:53: Oh, that's brilliant.

00:51:55: I love what you described about your intention about pop and euphoria and I really resonate

00:52:04: with that.

00:52:05: I think that's still what I'm just trying to do.

00:52:09: When I find edits or remixes of a really amazing pop song that's kind of embedded in

00:52:15: more like a darker club track, it's kind of like I found a track recently that's got

00:52:22: like finally, finally it's happened to me, that vocal just sort of embedded in this quite

00:52:28: dark track.

00:52:29: I just love the mix and you get everyone being like, "Woo!" and then it's very heavy.

00:52:34: I still want people to sort of be having that playful experience and that kind of connection

00:52:39: to a nostalgic moment or, "Oh, this song!"

00:52:44: I love when you can look out and see people having that moment where they're like, "Oh,

00:52:49: is it this track?"

00:52:51: That's something I always love to see.

00:52:53: Is there a record that you could choose from your early sets as a DJ so we can get an idea

00:53:01: of what you were playing at the time?

00:53:02: Yeah.

00:53:03: The reason I picked this song is because it's something that I relied on quite heavily

00:53:09: with, we were talking to you and mentioning about mixing, having been given this opportunity

00:53:14: to DJ, having no experience.

00:53:16: I had to rely on songs that you press play.

00:53:18: The moment you press play, there's hands in the air and I think "Had Away What Is Love"

00:53:23: is a song that you press play and instantly it has an impact and I still love it for that

00:53:30: reason and I still have found myself in situations where the track's about to end and I'm running

00:53:35: out of time so I just quickly find that song and press play and it remedies any chaotic

00:53:41: mixing.

00:53:42: I did that recently so it made me think about that time and it's got that right level of

00:53:47: emotion and playfulness and sing along whilst being on the dance floor.

00:53:53: It's a great choice.

00:53:54: I love that.

00:53:55: It's a great track from that era as well.

00:53:57: Actually regarding Get Together, I wanted to tell you that we were both at Homo Block

00:54:02: and I didn't want to bother you prior to your gig because I don't know if you're quite

00:54:09: chill before your gig.

00:54:10: I'm very chill usually before my gig and I'm not super social so I kind of thought your

00:54:17: gig had finished and I went up to your room and I knocked on the door and I was like "I

00:54:21: want to say hello to Romy" but you weren't there.

00:54:25: But actually prior to that when I finished my gig and I was walking through the enormity

00:54:31: of Homo Block which is huge, you were playing Get Together and I was like "I haven't heard

00:54:36: this in a club."

00:54:37: It was so good.

00:54:38: Oh, amazing.

00:54:39: Oh, thank you.

00:54:40: Yeah, I really wished that I'd seen you at Homo Block.

00:54:44: It's an amazing experience at Homo Block just to see the scale of that event.

00:54:50: I also had quite a lot of friends there.

00:54:52: A lot of people that were kind of excited to be letting their guard down, shall we say.

00:54:58: And I'm there trying to get ready for the show and I always like seeing people before

00:55:03: the show but I just need like five minutes just to do some vocal warm-ups and stuff.

00:55:07: So I would have loved to have seen you before.

00:55:09: So next time if we're in the same place please do say hi.

00:55:12: But I did have to take a little bit of a moment away from everyone.

00:55:16: There were so many people I wanted to see.

00:55:18: I really wanted to see you.

00:55:20: And then when you're kind of getting ready, well I've found now getting ready to sing

00:55:24: and perform slightly different than when I'm getting ready to go up and DJ.

00:55:28: Absolutely.

00:55:29: So I needed to take a little bit more time to do my vocal warm-ups.

00:55:34: I've done vocal warm-ups now in quite a few club environments where I just have to put

00:55:38: headphones in and sing.

00:55:40: And no one can hear me because I'm in a club.

00:55:43: But I can hear the vocal warm-up routine.

00:55:45: So I probably look crazy.

00:55:49: You just don't want your dressing room to get so busy that you have to step out of it

00:55:52: to have quiet.

00:55:53: Because of the point.

00:55:54: That is quiet.

00:55:55: They need to step out so that you could have your...

00:55:57: I would say energetically as a person.

00:56:00: I would be more likely to step out of my dressing room than to ask everybody in Italy.

00:56:06: But maybe I should be better at singing.

00:56:08: Guys can I have some space?

00:56:10: So we talked about so much and I wanted to ask you as a touring, travelling artist and

00:56:16: as a queer person with the life experiences that you've had, do you have a sanity practice

00:56:24: in this crazy world?

00:56:26: Do you have a way of staying relatively sane or buffering yourself from the craziness?

00:56:35: I'm really curious of how we all manage it.

00:56:37: I'm fascinated as well to know what everyone does.

00:56:40: I'd love to hear what you do.

00:56:43: I think that I've been relying on Headspace quite a bit actually, the app.

00:56:48: There are these sleep casts or stories, kind of like a children's story.

00:56:54: I'm interested in this kind of scientific balance of what words they say to you to

00:56:59: make you hypnotise you asleep.

00:57:01: I think it must be something like that.

00:57:05: That feeling after a show of lying there and just, "I can't sleep."

00:57:09: I'm just full of adrenaline and I'm just trying to wind down.

00:57:13: So I've just been trying to find healthy ways to do that.

00:57:19: That's been quite helpful to use that as a mindfulness tool.

00:57:23: I always try and get out and see where I am.

00:57:26: I really don't like it just going straight to the venue if I can help it.

00:57:30: I just try and find a place to get a coffee just to feel like I'm there.

00:57:35: That really helps me.

00:57:37: I'm trying to work in more exercise as part of the touring experience but that's not

00:57:44: always easy.

00:57:45: Just seeing a familiar face at festivals I think is great for me.

00:57:50: So please next time it would be lovely to see you in that festival environment.

00:57:54: I'm going to come and hug you for sure.

00:57:58: Do you ever get lows after performing or gigging?

00:58:02: Do you ever get a bit of a performer low?

00:58:06: Definitely.

00:58:07: I think I found after Homo Block, especially trying something new on a stage of that scale,

00:58:15: the next day I felt quite overexposed in a way.

00:58:17: I was like, "How was that?

00:58:21: How did it go?"

00:58:22: Looking out and trying to connect, especially in a festival environment, I love the feeling

00:58:27: of that it's so many more new people that might be experiencing your music than they

00:58:32: might not know who you are and I love that.

00:58:35: When you're trying something new it's sometimes a bit like, "You don't know how it went."

00:58:40: I left that experience feeling a little bit like, "Ah."

00:58:45: That can be difficult in terms of anxiety and feeling just like, "There's a part of

00:58:49: me that wants to try these things and put myself out there and to go out of my comfort

00:58:54: zone."

00:58:55: There's an attraction to it.

00:58:56: It's a part of me that says, "Go for it.

00:58:59: Try something new."

00:59:00: Then there's the part of you that the next day that goes, "Oh, that was...

00:59:05: How did that go?"

00:59:06: I kind of battled that quite a lot of the time, I think being an intrinsically shy person

00:59:11: that likes to try these things.

00:59:14: There's a moment where I feel quite anxious.

00:59:17: I totally relate to that.

00:59:19: I've kind of learned not to really trust my head the day after.

00:59:23: Yeah, that's good.

00:59:24: Because I kind of realise a lot of its tiredness and when I'm tired I tend to be a little bit

00:59:29: more unkind to myself mentally.

00:59:31: Yeah.

00:59:32: Oh, I relate to that.

00:59:33: My friend said, "We went for a dance after my set at Home O'Block."

00:59:40: She said, "What are you thinking about right now?"

00:59:44: I said, "Oh, no."

00:59:45: She's like, "Are you being kind to yourself?"

00:59:48: She spotted that I went to a place where I was maybe just dissecting the gig and she's

00:59:53: like, "I can see you maybe being unkind."

00:59:56: I think that's helpful just to recognise that maybe...

00:59:59: I like that thought that in therapy and stuff I've heard about the idea that would you talk

01:00:05: to yourself unkindly?

01:00:08: How would you talk to your friend?

01:00:09: Like, try and be kinder to yourself.

01:00:12: If you told me that you had a difficult gig or the way I would talk to you would not

01:00:18: be the same way that I just talked to myself, thought I had a difficult gig.

01:00:22: Exactly.

01:00:23: It's good to try and remember that and I like the idea that you're saying, "Maybe if you're

01:00:27: tired you're not always trust that voice in your head."

01:00:31: In times that might feel a bit tougher when you might be tired or being less kind to yourself

01:00:37: than we should be.

01:00:39: Is there a track you can lean on?

01:00:41: Yes, there is a track by Beverly Gran Copeland called "Levita" which is the inspiration

01:00:47: for my song "Enjoy Your Life."

01:00:49: It contains the lyrics.

01:00:51: My mother says to me, "Enjoy your life," which I thought was such a beautiful sentence

01:00:55: and really resonated with me, thinking about my mom dying when I was younger and just the

01:01:01: different...

01:01:02: The way that I've experienced the kind of idea that life is short and wanting to make

01:01:07: the best of it, but not acknowledging that that's not always easy.

01:01:12: You can have the intention to try and live life to the full and be positive all the time,

01:01:17: but then sometimes you wake up and it's...

01:01:19: You know, you don't feel like that.

01:01:21: When I heard that song, I connected to the intention of having a song or some words

01:01:27: that can be a reminder to bring you back to that intention of wanting to try and see

01:01:32: the positive.

01:01:33: The whole lyrics of the song are really beautiful and just the kind of acknowledging that things

01:01:39: can be challenging, acknowledging that there's a lot to do in the day, but then that kind

01:01:44: of clarity of trying to enjoy life.

01:01:48: I watched an amazing live stream of Glenn in lockdown and it was almost like a spiritual

01:01:55: sort of experience.

01:01:58: I was up late one night and he was doing a live stream, I think from Canada and I couldn't

01:02:04: sleep and I was just watching this performance and I just found it so healing and so comforting

01:02:10: and his energy and presence is very beautiful and wholesome and kind.

01:02:19: I just felt like, "Oh, I really need this."

01:02:21: I was so grateful to have discovered his music.

01:02:25: Thank you for introducing me to it.

01:02:27: I didn't know it.

01:02:28: Oh, that's great.

01:02:29: It's so beautiful.

01:02:30: Even before the lyrics, as an instrumental piece of music as well, there's something

01:02:36: about it that's very nature.

01:02:37: Yeah, all of the work that he does is quite unique and I found it very beautiful.

01:02:45: That's why I chose him.

01:02:47: Can you give us a current killer track in your record bag?

01:02:53: Yeah, so I've chosen to play or to share, I should say, just a remix of Sonic that I've

01:03:00: basically played every single time I DJ and it's not a brand new track.

01:03:05: It's not like a fresh sort of secret song but I wanted to share it because I felt like

01:03:11: it has surprised me the way that this song, which feels very much part of my subconscious

01:03:18: from growing up, it's kind of like a trancy remix.

01:03:21: I played it in different parts of the world and people just seem to like, it whips off

01:03:26: this kind of joyful play for energy that I really love and I kind of want to bottle and

01:03:33: I can't seem to recreate it with any other song so I just keep playing this song.

01:03:38: So it just kind of gets people excited and in some parts of the world I'm like, do you

01:03:43: know who Sonic is?

01:03:44: Do you know this song or are you just feeling the energy of this version of it?

01:03:48: Which I'm fascinated by.

01:03:50: Is there anything you can plug or tell us about it tomorrow?

01:03:54: You've had an insane year.

01:03:56: I am so grateful that I've had a lot of fun this year and I've been able to share this

01:04:02: new music and to feel people excited about it means the world to me and I'm excited in

01:04:08: the new year to try to make some more music for this project and to make more music with

01:04:14: the XX and just to keep kind of trying new things and I did a show in London recently

01:04:20: and that was really special to me to be able to play this music to a group of people that

01:04:26: it wasn't a festival, it was they had chosen to be there and they'd chosen to listen to

01:04:30: the album and that was a very special experience and felt quite healing after me feeling quite

01:04:35: vulnerable and anxious after Homer Block and I'm going to be doing some more shows in the

01:04:42: new year.

01:04:43: I guess that's my plug that I'd but I'm looking forward to connecting in that live way which

01:04:52: I think is so special.

01:04:53: Romy, this has been such a pleasure.

01:04:57: I mean, I know we've spoken before and there's a lovely connection there but this has been

01:05:02: such a privilege to sit and chat with you.

01:05:06: I can't wait to see you again in person and give you a massive hug.

01:05:10: Oh, you too.

01:05:11: It's been really lovely speaking to you and thank you for your lovely questions and the

01:05:15: space to talk about all of this stuff.

01:05:20: You've been listening to "Queerly Beloved" with me, Cormac.

01:05:23: You can find the playlist of all the music featured in today's episode in the episode

01:05:28: description and while you're there please do hit subscribe so you don't miss out on

01:05:33: my conversations with other talented people.

01:05:36: A big thank you to Michael Lane, my producer, my manager, Melissa Taylor at tailored communication

01:05:43: and of course to Amazon Music for their support.

01:05:46: Take care of yourself, all the best.

01:05:48: Bye.

01:05:49: (upbeat music)